I am trying to decide between purchasing the Nomad and the SO3.
Here is my dilemma:
I can only buy one machine.
I need to do PCB work.
I need to do wood, aluminum, etc., preferably in sizes larger than the Nomad handles.
I am concerned about the ability of the SO3 to do as good a job on PCBs as the Nomad.
If SO3 can’t make the grade on milling PCBs I will have to buy the Nomad.
So, for those of you who have been hands on with these machines, please guide me. Thanks.
@rwizard I have a shapeoko 3 and am designing my first PCB currently. It is really exciting for me. I have a bunch of 1 sided FR1 circuit board stock 2 in × 3 in, upload a gerber file, and I’ll attempt to mill one for you. Then you can decide based on the results.
PCBs are often FR4 or Garolite. Those are friable (“easily crumbled”) materials (wood, Fiberglass, and carbon composite too). When using a CNC machine on them, they generate particles that are extremely dangerous to your lungs and health. Appropriate precautions should be taken; budgeting for an enclosure, dust collector and dust separator is critical.
In general, plastics and metals are fine - unless one mills them until they start smoking. 
mark
Thanks, what a generous offer.
Unfortunately, I haven’t got anything handy to send you. I’m in the process of returning to this stuff after a long hiatus, and I have no access to my old files.
I would appreciate hearing from you as you progress in your efforts. I hope to place an order in the next several days, so it is possible I will have to simply make a decision and live with it.
There is a lot I like about the Nomad (lead screws, “real” spindle), but the small size is killing me, so I really hope that someone is going to tell me the SO3 is just as good for this stuff.
Thanks again for your reply.
Hi Mark,
I am familiar with the safety hazards, which I suppose are one of the positives of the Nomad, since it is enclosed and may be more suited to dust control. So many interesting activities (telescope mirror making for example) carry these sorts of risks.
However, my issue really boils down to whether the SO3 is able to produce PCB milling results comparable to the Nomad, so I really hope we can confine the thread to that specific issue.
Thanks very much for your reply, and as you have indicated, safety is of course paramount.
I am familiar with the safety hazards, which I suppose are one of the positives of the Nomad, since it is enclosed and may be more suited to dust control.
Excellent! The Nomad enclosure gives one a “head start”. Negative pressure, dust heads, dust collectors and dust separators finish the job.
An enclosure for an SO3 doesn’t have to be complex or expensive. Some examples (and still growing) may be found here:
So many interesting activities (telescope mirror making for example) carry these sorts of risks.
WOOHOO! Astrophysics in my background. Mirror making. Foucault tests. Diffraction/ring patterns. Parabolize.
Yes, the grits and glass particles can be nasty.
However, my issue really boils down to whether the SO3 is able to produce PCB milling results comparable to the Nomad, so I really hope we can confine the thread to that specific issue.
Both machines are more than capable of PCB work - there are examples of both on this forum and a SO3 forum. The Nomad has a spindle by default. It’s smaller and stiffer than the SO3.
The SO3 can have a spindle and adding a sea-of-holes metal bed will stiffen it quite nicely. @WillAdams can point to some additional stiffening things that can be done. I would certainly get the limit/home kit. The Dewalt router seems to be the hot choice now-a-days.
The smallest repeatability (accuracy/precision) goes to the Nomad.
Unless you line widths are incredibly small, the differences are not likely to affect the quality of the PCB. The size of the PCB and other projects would seem to be the deciding factor. The budget would have to take in account any enclosure and air handling.
Would being off by 2-5 thousandths make any difference to the PCB work you’re doing?
mark
Modifications should all be here:
http://www.shapeoko.com/wiki/index.php/Shapeoko_3#Modifications
My suggestions:
Might want to look at an alternate spindle, a Kress, Ugra, or the Wolfgang Engineering spindle.
Thanks for the info Mark. Five thousandths might be an issue (pitches and parts just keep getting smaller - I miss DIP packages and thru-hole), but looking at some of the mods, maybe I could tune the SO3 to do a little better. I really like the Nomad, and may have to find a way to fund a second machine if I can’t make the SO3 work. If only there were a lead screw version of the SO3. Oh well, I have to make the leap to something, we’ll see in the next few days which way I jump.
Will,
Thanks for the help. I have some Makita woodworking kit, including one of their big old planers, but it is all Japanese built. I gather they are doing more in China, but I still like the idea of Makita better than DeWalt. I will certainly look into the alternate spindles you suggest. I was also looking at a control board for modding routers to get spindle speed control. I guess I need to figure out if the SO3 controller has support for spindle speed ? Worst case I guess I could use a different controller, but I assume that would keep me from using Carbide Create?
Why is everything I take on like a trip down the rabbit hole ; ) ? Good thing I have all you guys to help me find my way. Thanks.
Five thousandths might be an issue (pitches and parts just keep getting smaller - I miss DIP packages and thru-hole), but looking at some of the mods, maybe I could tune the SO3 to do a little better.
Surface mount tolerances are pretty tight. Many hobbyists only use through-hole… which is why I asked.
I really like the Nomad, and may have to find a way to fund a second machine if I can’t make the SO3 work. If only there were a lead screw version of the SO3. Oh well, I have to make the leap to something, we’ll see in the next few days which way I jump.
By-the-by, using the wide belts and going with top flight belts does not mean the SO3 isn’t that good. Belt drive small CNC machines can get down to 0.002-0.003" repeatability (provided everything else can). Just don’t over tax the machine and stretch the belts!
A really stiffened SO3 with the sea-of-holes bed (a single piece of MIC6 Al alloy) will definitely bring the repeatability lower. Hand picking routers, using specialized collets and such improve things even more. The difficulty is that we cannot say how far things will go.
An SO3 with 0.001" repeatability (like the Nomad)… probably not. Will the repeatability be higher than 0.005". Almost definitely not. Can it lowered? Yes. I would be surprised if it can be brought down to 0.002". @WillAdams may know just how tight people have been able to go.
I went the Nomad 883 Pro route for at home myself… but I have access to Haas, Tormach, Shopbot and others when I need large format machines.
mark
One alternative would be something like SuperPID. I don’t know how it would be connected -or if it can - to an SO3 for M command control of the RPM.
mark
One can get direct spindle control w/ the SO3 controller: http://www.shapeoko.com/wiki/index.php/Spindle_Control#Speed_Control — Grbl supports this, and I’d be surprised if Carbide Create can’t be set to send through the command for spindle speed.
I’ve had quite good repeatability on my SO3 — I’ve re-run some jobs at just slightly lower depths and things seemed to line up perfectly, throughout the cut.
Tim Foreman on the SO3 forums is getting his machine upgraded a bit, and is getting quite good numbers.
Mark & Will,
Thanks folks for the great input. I can see I have a bit more study to do. I’m now considering Nomad+SO3, but that is not only a budget buster, it is a consumer of precious shop space.
I really appreciate how helpful everyone has been. This is a great community, something you don’t always find.
Regards.
@rwizard Well I personally can’t recommend the SO3. Just got done trying to mill my PCB. Almost as soon as the bit touches the copper, I get a serial disconnect.
Edit:
Yes @WillAdams I’ve got quite the email thread going with support. Carbide3D are some pretty awesome people. They do stand behind their products. Earlier I was really frustrated. Eventually I did get a PCB to cut, although something with bCNC’s autolevel feature was not working quite right. There is an issue open for that. For my first ever attempt at designing and milling a PCB, I’m pretty happy.
USB disconnection has been an on-going issue. Please see http://www.shapeoko.com/wiki/index.php/Electronics#Recommendations
If that doesn’t work, contact support@carbide3d.com and they will get you squared away.
