Mafell Spindle with manual tool change FM 1000 PV-WS

Hi Guys,

I just found that Maffell got two new spindles out with a manual quick tool change.

FM 1000 PV-WS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1cJW_xCCQs

what you are thinking about ?
did some of you is already using Maffell spindles ?

The only thing that keeps me away from this are the Brushes… i am using a Chinese spindle and that thing performes super and it is very quiet even with air cooling im around 60db. (without load)

But a missing tool change always bothers me…

what are you thinking ? any Maffell users around here ?

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I want one — the problem is it’s only an option on 220V units — I’d have to run line and have an electrician install a 220V outlet — the unit which takes DC is interesting — is it brushless? Could a power supply be rigged up to run this on 110V?

you are right there is a dc version… i completely missed that

@WillAdams

I didnt found any repair information about the PV version but the in their repair catalogue is a 120V version listed…
image

i think we have to wait until they release their repair drawing or i give them a quick call tomorrow

https://service.mafell.de/media/bedienungsanleitung/fm800_fm1000_170558_0220_i.pdf

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Dang, that looks about like a perfect Shapeoko spindle. Any info on price or availabilty in the US?

RMW

One U.S. supplier:

https://www.timberwolftools.com/mafell-fm-1000-ws-milling-motor

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$679.00 for a manual albeit quick tool change…no thanks.

Thanks Will, should have figured it would be Timberwolf.

A drawback is the 8mm shaft and apparently only metric adapters, my tooling is .25"-.125". I see there’s a ER 16 adapter but presume that eliminates the quick change benefit and might introduce runout.

Just daydreaming anyway, I’ll stick with the PID controller I guess.

RMW

I believe the ER16 adapter would fit in the 8mm collet — so you could have as many quick change ER16 tools as you were willing to fork over ~$92.90 for, though to be fair, just a pair would work fine (you could swap while the other tool was running) — assuming of course the runout is low enough.

The price is a real hurdle, and obviously one I haven’t been able to clear — I have to admit a big part of my desire is a fascination with the mechanism and curiousity as to how it works, the last time we discussed this the Makita RT0700/0701 and analogues such as the Carbide Compact Router came out as the best possible value (for folks who don’t need software speed control and are willing to tolerate a brushed motor).

Okay, called a distributor in Germany and yes the PV version is without carbon brushes.

Prices are prices… maffel sees itself as a premium German tool brand like festool or hilti and they are priced like this because they can. But maaaan I am really thinking to buy the PV version now…

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If it can profitably be run off a power supply on a 15 or 20 Amp 110V line, that makes it a lot more interesting for me. (Yes, I probably spend more time setting up for cuts than I do actually cutting which is why making the cutting time more efficient is desirable for me).

The manual suggests that the FM 1000 PV-WS simply adds remote control and monitoring to the FM 1000 WS. The FM 100 WSW is available for ~$500 from Denmark.. It’s capable of "Output power: 560W" (70% that of a 800 W HF Spindle) and "Concentricity of <0,10mm at a distance of 25mm"
"Noise emission values determined according to DIN EN ISO 3744:
Sound pressure level LPA = 71 dB (A) [at minimum speed?]
Uncertainty KPA = 3 dB (A)
Sound power level LPA = 82 dB (A) [at maximum speed?]
Uncertainty KPA = 3 dB (A)
The noise measurement was done without tool at idling speed."

It’s probably better to get dedicated collets ("Collet Ø 1/8“ (3.175 mm) Order No. 093735 - Collet Ø 1/4“ (6.35 mm) Order No. 093736") from(?) because;
"Maximum speed when using a collet adapter The recommended maximum speed for the use of the collet chuck adapter OZ and the collet chuck adapter ER is max. 16000 rpm."

Since they only require 1000 Watts, a step up transformer can be used to power them from a standard 115 V circuit. But “Mains frequency / Hz = 50” vs. US 60 Hz standard - so who knows?

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The AMB (Kress) 1050 FM-UI DI costs ~$600, comes with a precision ER16 collet (ER20 optional!), and has a digital interface. The data sheet shows that a 110V version is available, but AMB’s website (Google will translate it to English) doesn’t list it - but they do show a 230V version with ATC!

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ATC: https://mctinfo.net/amb-spindle/1050-fme-w-di

I almost went down one of these routes, but the cons of still being air cooled, brushed, run out that is comparable to my Makita, 24/5K Max RPM, and the ER collet adapter reducing the RPM even more. Felt I was compromising too much just for Q/ATC from AMB/Maffell.

I also debated the USOVO Tool Changer Adapter (65mm) (https://www.cnccat.com/index.php?id=2&productid=1964&catid=89&subcatid=&lang=en), was on eBay to get USA shipping, but can’t find it anymore. However a used one showed up: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pnuematic-CNC-Tool-Changer-for-65mm-Spindle-w-4-tool-holders-and-5-collets/274289582982?hash=item3fdceee386:g:yQwAAOSwMwNeBlo~ (looks like a nice deal).

There is also an adapter for 80mm from Mechatron but the price increases to ~$950.

The main con I have with these is they use SK10/15/20 tool holders, which can be hard to source in the states, for a reasonable price. (Edit) Also most only go up to ER11, SK20 is ER16.

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Not to mention that it costs $1322, even without the pneumatic system! Then there’s the added complexity and considerable additional expense of the tool holders and additional runout they cause. Seems like the $600 quick change 1050 FM-UI DI is a better choice, especially if a precision ER20 collet option is available!

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Apparently this will work with a step-up/down transformer.

The specific unit suggested was

so I’m hoping that that would work plugged into my BitRunner, and that the various size collets (1/8", 3mm, 4mm, and 6mm are available in addition to the afore-mentioned ER-16 adapter and an OZ collet chuck adapter) will work out.

One thing which is confusing/concerning:

https://produkte.mafell.de/en/accessories/adapter-sleeve-ground-6-mm-1/4-in.

is apparently good for both 6mm and 1/4"? Hoping that doesn’t have implications for runout.

Of course, if someone could work up a cable which would connect the:

version to the BitRunner adapter, I’d have to try that.

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Has anyone considered Mafell FM 1000 WS?

This machine is very silent and easy to use.

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Looks a lot like a Kress (which I’ve always been surprised by being characterized as noisy).

There was a general purpose dust shoe shown at: Dust Shoe for Kress, Mafell, and other (?) Spindles / Milling Motors by nbernard - Thingiverse

and they’re sold in the U.S. at: Mafell FM 1000 Milling Motor 9M0023 - Timberwolf Tools w/ a 6mm collet, and 1/8" collets as options and they are well-regarded in industry: http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-tools-accessories/festool-and-mafell/

with this quote being enticing:

Mafell is better engineered. They pay more attention to details and machining touching surfaces to eliminate any tolerances and play. They also seem to be more robust and resistant to wear and tear in my experience.

I haven’t been able to justify a Kress spindle, but this may make the cut for my next indulgence, esp. since the speed range (4,000–25,000) seems more useful in the sort of work I do.