I could use some advice on turning an unused bedroom into a small workshop where I plan to assemble a S5P (most likely 4’x2’).
I am not new to CNC. I’ve been at my current full-time job for over 8 years now, predominantly working with CNC Routers, engravers, and lasers. Much of my work over the years was working the CNC Routers cutting plastics like HDPE and Polycarbonate, so I am very comfortable and confident with CAD/CAM and operating the machines. Most of our machines are 2’x4’ AVID CNC routers and recently we got a 4’x8’ Laguna FWIW.
Now I want to buy my own CNC router with the goal of making things from both wood and plastics to make some extra money on the side, and perhaps even more in the future if it goes well. I am passionate about it and have the funds, but my biggest obstacle is that I live in an apartment (on the 2nd floor), so I can’t get one there. My parents live 30 minutes away, and on the first floor of their bi-level house, they have a couple of unused bedrooms (my old bedroom and my brother’s old bedroom). They do have a garage, but its way too crowded to do anything in there. They fully support me in using one of the old bedrooms as a workshop, but I just want to make sure I am doing things right and safe.
My plan, so far, is to get an electrician to do an inspection of the outlets/wires to make sure it will handle the load (I will be getting the 110V VFD spindle kit) of everything. I will definitely have a dust collection system hooked up. I wasn’t planning on building an enclosure around the machine itself, but if it ends up being necessary, I will go that route. The floor in the room is already hard flooring (vinyl). The dimensions of the room is about 12’x12’ (will be going tomorrow to take accurate measurements and draw up a layout for the room). I think the 4’x2’ machine will be best for me, and then I should have room for other things like workbenches, storage, toolboxes, etc. I will definitely makes sure to keep a fire extinguisher and working smoke alarm in the room, and I won’t leave the machine running unattended.
Overall, what are some other things that I should take into account? I believe the 2 biggest things that I have to worry about most is fine dust and noise. The good thing is that nobody lives in any of the room on this bottom floor (they all live upstairs). Should I get some ventilation system going or air filtration or something like that? What else should I plan out to make sure I am doing things the safe way to not put my family (or myself) in any harm?
Are you planning on working on sheet goods or lumber or metal or plastics? Stock size?
Biggest limitations working indoors:
loading stock
storing stock
noise
Decouple the machine from the floor — the vibration dampening pads such as are used for appliances are an easy starting point, putting the machine on a sheet of foam helps dampen noise/vibration as well.
Other considerations — where will you prepare stock for cutting? post-process parts after cutting? Finishing?
I would suggest an enclosure to contain dust & reduce noise. A light 1x6 fence board frame to attach Rockwool Comfortboard80 all around does a good job.
I had my SPROXXL setup for a few months in a basement like this & it provided enough noise dampening to readily ignore remaining noise outside of the room.
I’d like to make custom wood signs or trinkets to perhaps sell on etsy or craft shows, at least at first. Also, I may work with acrylic or HDPE. I’m used to working with pre-cut sheets at work, so I never thought about processing materials before machining them. I’ll have to look more into that.
Yes, I will have to keep storage in mind. And yes, I found some good ideas utilizing foam sheets under the machine for that exact thing you mention, and I love the idea.
All, really good things that I will need to figure out. Thank you!
Make sure you get a workbench that has wheels. With the 4x2 you can tile larger projects if you want to and having wheels will enable to to cut larger projects. Dont say you will never do that because never becomes sometimes. As others suggested an enclosure would be best since you in your living space. Fine dust is still cast all over even with a dust collection system. The enclosure will also help encapsulate any noise you generate. With the 4x2 you can build your own enclosure on the Shapeoko. What are you going to use for dust collection. A regular dust collector is quite noisy. Several here on the forum have liked the Dewalt Stelthsonic. Ones that have a HEPA filter are useful because shop vacs still spew fine dust out the exhaust port. If you can put your dust exhaust port out the window better.
Yeah, I was debating whether to get wheels or not. That sounds like enough of a reason for me to make sure I have wheels.
Honestly, I didn’t decide on the dust collection system yet and just assumed they were all going to be nearly equally as loud, so thank you for that suggestion on that vac! Ultimately, yes, I think I should really get one with a HEPA filter, though.
Before the DeWalt Stealthsonic was available, in a noise-induced, migraine-fueled rage, I bought a Festool CT Midi (older model, pre-Bluetooth) and an Oneida Ultimate Dust Deputy.
I would make a simple 2D layout of the room and proposed items that are going in there.
Include door swings, windows, closets in the room perimeter layout.
Adding power and lighting locations helps.
You can do it with paper ( grid paper ).
You make a list of everything you going to get so far.
It doesn’t have to be complete, but comprehensive. It will expand.
You should add some columns of attributes like power, etc … for each item,
Use your CAD system of choice or the paper method ( cut out the area) shape ) for each item.
Paper in the beginning is quick.
Find a place for raw materials and trash !
Take your shapes and overlay them on your room layout.
I’m thinking of going with a Festool CT. if i go with that, do you recommend the mullet cyclone? Or for an extra couple of hundred there is a Festool cyclone unit that stacks on top of the extractor.
Also, does the Festool have good enough suction (combined with the sweepy boot) to collect most of the chips from the Shapeoko router?
A cyclone separator works to keep the big chips out of your filter bag. I have a 4" Jet 1.5 HP dust collector with a lot of suction and still dust escapes. The router bit throws big chunks a long way. The fine dust is collected but I dont think and dust collection will ever be 100%. Festool is very proud of their equipment. If you like what they have then get it but there are many others that are equal in vacuum power to the Festool brand dust extraction. As to the cyclone separator they all work well that is more about what fits in your space. The Onieda dust deputy is good and Home Depot sells one that fits on top of a 5 gallon bucket. Not sure I would spend a lot of money on the Festool cyclone but it is your money to spend.
is engineered/optimized for contractor usage for drywall, and that it’s not as convenient beyond that specific task (but that’s based on just reading some discussions on FOG (Festool Owner’s Group):
I operate a 4x4 out of an apartment. Fine dust is an annoyance but you can deal with MOST (never all) of it with a good shop vac with a hepa filter. If you can use dust extraction it will be much better.
My CNC shop room is also 12x12, I used 4 of those cheap shelving racks, bolted them together in an L shape for rigidity. I also have a worktable and I enjoy having magnet bars on the wall for my wrenches, allan keys, t handles etc.
Noise can be mitigated by either adding a layer of drywall to the walls, building an enclosure, and through other means like vibration dampening by adding a layer of 3mm thick rubber between the table and the machine and or putting a few eva foam pads under the legs of the table. Make sure the door is well sealed on the room (I just replaced the sweep under the door as ours is a gnarly tight fit as is) a fire extinguisher is good but highly unlikely if you keep your dust extraction system well maintained. DO NOT SAND IN THIS ROOM i can not stress that enough. I am guilty AF of this and it is the bane of my existence when I do it. The only time sanding might be acceptable is if you have a mirka or a fein or festool random orbit sander/vac combo, but if you can just do it in the garage.
Also the guy talking about comfortboard, listen to him. Best bang for your buck for noise suppression but not super cheap.
Is the AFCI breakers not good for the VFD spindle, like GFCI? I am not experienced with electric, so I am going to have an electrician come and do an inspection/give quote for any needed circuits/upgrades. Not sure if you can tell much from this pic, but here is the breaker panel for the whole house (I still have to check to see which breaker is responsible for the outlets in that room):
I am assuming that work will definitely need to be done so I can run the Shapeoko, the 1.2kw spindle, PC, and dust collection system simultaneously . I was also planning to get a small WEN air filtration unit (which shouldn’t use much power), some LED shop lights, and some other small power tools.
I am going to be taking dust collection seriously, and am willing to shell out the extra for a festool / cyclone combo, air filtration unit hanging from ceiling, and exhaust fan one of the windows, as well as making sure room is sealed nicely around the door especially. I will even use a mask in there, most likely for extra precaution. With all those things, is it still a bad idea to sand in that room(say if I hooked up the sander to the festool if it wasnt being used for the router at the moment)? The garage is always an option for something like that if I need to.
Once I get the machine(and dust collection) up and running, I will then consider noise suppression.
I downloaded your picture but it was too blurry to tell for sure about your breakers. That seems like an old box but it could have had the breakers updated.
GFCI is Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter That is constantly checking for a delta between each of the 3 legs. If the GFCI sees the delta decrease it snaps the breaker off. The purpose is to keep you from getting shocked. A washing machine is usually steel sitting on rubber feet. So if the hot was to short to ground or the case when you touched the washing machine case you would be shocked. Because the GFCI would sense the short of the hot to the case it would preemptively shut off the circuit keep you from being shocked. On VFD (spindles) they are creating 3 phase power and when the motor slows or speeds up the GFCI senses the imbalance and shuts off the circuit breaker. Although the change is normal the GCFI does not agree and that is why you usually canot run a VFD on a GFCI circuit.
AFCI Arc Fault Circuit Interrupter Your AFCI breaker trips due to hazardous sparking, helping to protect you from electrical fires. Common reasons for your AFCI breaker trips include incompatibility, faulty devices, damaged or faulty wiring, and overloaded circuits. Identify the problem by isolating the device or circuit that’s having issues. If you have ever plugged in a lamp that was already switched on you get an arc at the plug. This would trip the AFCI to prevent that arc from catching your curtains on fire.
AFCI/GFCI Combination This is a relatively new device that combines both the Arc Fault and Ground Fault into a single breaker and/or outlet. You can install AFCI/GFCI breakers that would protect an entire circuit or just an outlet and only protect that outlet.
When I installed my home electrical circuit I used the outlets for GFCI because the breakers for GFCI and/or AFCI are double wide. I only had so many places for electric breakers and space was at a premium. GFCI is required any place you are subject to water. Usually your front/back porch outlets are GFCI as well as outlets in a garage. When you drive your wet car into the garage you are subject to electrical shock. They have been using GFCI per US electrical code for about 20 years. Before in older homes you would have to retrifit the breakers or place a GFCI outlet to protect that outlet and any down the line. GFCI has a Load and an Input lug. You put the incoming wire on the input and any down the stream outlets on the load side. AFCI is similar with an input and a load lug. For my living spaces I installed the dual GFCI/ARCI per electrical code. They took up a lot of room in my breaker panel so for circuits that only needed GFCI I just put a GFCI outlet in the first circuit in a run to save space in my panel.
I had a Jet 1220 variable speed lathe. If it was attached to a GFCI outlet if I changed the speed it would trip the GFCI outlet off. So I have a single nonGFCI outlet in my shop. I sold the little Jet and got a Jet 1642 with a VFD. The same thing would happen if I plugged the 120v Jet 1642 VFD into a GFCI outlet. So I use that single nonGFCi outlet to run that lathe. If I were to get a spindle with VFD I would have to have a nonGFCi outlet for the spindle.
These GFCI/AFCI outlets are designed to make us safer. However in certain situations that are making you frustrated. Just do not circumvent these safety devices without considering the consequences of what could happen with them defeated. It is fine for a particular situation like a VFD but in general you should keep the GFCI/AFCI in place whenever possible for the safety of yourself and your family.
