This might have been a question best answered before I received the machine… but none the less
My plan was to use the Shapeoko 5 Pro with my old 1.5kw 80mm (water cooled) spindle, so I ordered the machine and an 80mm spindle mount (after confirming the z with support)
The machine arrived, and the 80mm mount does not fit, it has a different bolt pattern.
They have since updated the language on the mount page to reflect that it does not fit the SO5
And, as of now, support is only offering a refund on the mount… no solution.
the question now is, after stepping back and looking at the rest of the system, will it even support a full size 80mm, water cooled spindle and additional water lines on the 4x4 gantry?
The steppers look quite small compared to the beefy HDM steppers…
what is the consensus, If I mill a new back plate to mount the 80mm spindle, will the steppers have enough torque to swing it around?
Several people have posted that with heavy spidles the SO5 will drop the spindle when you emergency stop and/or power off the SO5. The weight on the HDZ is too much and it plummets down when power is turned off. As long as power is applied the stepper motors stay where they are but on power off the heavy spindles will cause the HDZ to drop.
As far as the spindle mount that is between you and C3D. Not positive but the C3D VFD is a 65MM spindle and is not as heavy as an 80MM spindles. Many suggest putting a piece of foam below the spindle before powering off. The C3D router is a 66MM Makita clone. So maybe you can mill your own mount if you use a Makita/C3D router with the 66MM router mount. Or maybe drill new holes in the 80MM spindle mount to use with the SO5.
They have stated here that a 80mm mount has been in production and is close to release.
The machine including the Z axis is perfectly capable of utilizing an 80mm spindle. There are almost no mid-range (and even “higher” range ones that don’t) CNC routers that the spindle doesn’t drop in when power is cut…6-figure industrial machines often do it when power is cut. I have been on a major aerospace company’s production floor when power went out several times and we all listened in horror as we heard spindles dig into material. On the Shapeoko, that doesn’t mean that the Z axis isn’t capable. It means the Z has very little friction and there isn’t a brake on the Z axis.
Josh is correct - any machine without some form of counter weight or brake system on the Z would drop with the power off. E stop is an emergency stop, not pause.
There is no technical limitation.
We know people are interested and it’s something we’re looking at.
right, im not judging it’s capability on whether it drops, my hdm drops on power loss, but am questioning the smaller steppers and whether the steppers on the so5 (compared to the HDM) will be able to move the 80mm with any amount of force without skipping steps…I would expect it to mostly affect the torque and speed limit of the z motion system?
what volt does the new controller run them at?
Running my SO5 Pro 4x4 with the C3D 1.2kw spindle, I would say the motion system can certainly handle a larger spindle. My machine will stall the spindle easily before the motion system gives up. And when I stalled the spindle, the motion system did some damage to the material still trying to move. Not super scientific, and I was using disposable material specifically to push until something failed. So I estimate the motion system would actually match with a 2.2kw spindle well. And the Z axis on the SO5 is mechanically the same as the HDM minus the extra torque of the larger stepper.
And to add… the HDZ with the same stepper and ball screw pitch on SO3s/SO4s/SO4Pros has shown on many machines to lift a 2.2 great… the SO5 Pro should do better.
I ordered mine in January and the 80 mm mount said it wouldn’t fit the pro 5, the holes in there mount need to be slotted outwards 2.5 mm to make it work .
FWIT the S5 uses a different pitch ball screw on the Z.
For clarification - there is no technical reason the current motors or setup would not support a larger or heavier spindle. The electronics and motion components have all been tested to ensure they are matched very well and able to handle pretty much anything that’s thrown at it.
Thanks for the responses, the “just trust me” response is fine for most purposes, but the specs would better share the technical limitation of the motion system.
for example, if I wanted to put an 8kw spindle on it, I think you might say , well that wont work…
Our HDM with your 110V 1500 W HF Spindle doesn’t drop with power off. Maybe that’s the better option since it’s probably adequate for most/all users? What do your three types of HF spindles weigh?
It’s likely that the addition of a 4PDT (or 2 DPDT) relay(s) shorting out the stepper motor windings with the normally closed contacts would provide enough motor braking to avoid the drop when power is off.
This is a little off topic. I purchased a Shapeoko 4 Pro and added the VFD spindle all works Perfect. My Question is If you use a water cooled spindle will the Bit Zero work. that is why i purchased the VFD Spindle from Shapeoko because it was plug and play. Not being A computer guy i need Plug And Play
The BitZero simply requires that the spindle be grounded, or a ground lead connected to it so as to complete the circuit when probing — any spindle should work w/ the BitZero — I have probably the most odd-ball setup of all, a Mafell FM 1000 WS and it works fine w/ all the Bit accessories.
@McFarlandCustoms here! I’m on instagram under that name if you want to see video of my 5pro with a 80mm spindle. I’ve had an 80mm spindle on my 5 pro since day one. Yes, it’ll drop on power down. But it handles it with ease. I did not buy a mount, I made one.
I also asked the 80mm spindle. they consider it. I also ask if a atc vdf spindle would come in time. they told me that this would raise the price off the machine a lot. they taked note off my question.
about the drop fall off the Z axes would a simple disk break with electromagnetic clamp be the most easy thing to do. the electromagnetic clamp goes open when power come up the machine and close with spiral when power drop looks for me a possible answer.
this could be installed on the upper part of the axes that comes out the stepper on the Z axes
Someone else had posted this before, but their is an electromagnetic brake for steppermotors that will apply the brakes when the power is disconnected. 40 bucks.
Wouldn’t it be nice if Carbide Motion displayed C3D spindle torques or currents so people would know when they’re cutting too aggressively? Or, at a minimum, have them shown on the VFDs’ remote-able displays?
Maybe… it’s that possible with a VFD? I claim ignorance there. But I have experienced and well calibrated ears that hear when the spindle is struggling.
Both are possible. Having the VFD display it should be trivial for those having the ability to configure it. The extension cable for the display is a RJ-45 ethernet cable.
On the Shapeoko, that doesn’t mean that the Z axis isn’t capable. It means the Z has very little friction and there isn’t a brake on the Z axis.