I’m considering purchasing a spindle. How important is the cooling? I understand that water cooled will keep the spindle cooler and run quieter. But I’ve also heard that an air cooled spindle will have better torque although I’m not sure how much effect it would have.
The water cooled adds another level of complexity. You have a chiller and the coolant and routing the cooling tubes over the Z axis. I am sure there are 120V water cooled but I think most of the water cooled ones are 220V. So another level of complexity having a 220V outlet for the spindle. The Shapeoko machines are pretty reliant but at some point a 220V spindle may be too much for some Shapeoko models. The SO3 and 4 are belt driven and the extra power and torque of a water cooled spindle pushes those machines to their limit. The HDM and SO5 are ball screw driven and can handle the torque of a big spindle. The other consideration is what are you machining. Wood can be handled pretty effectively by a router but metal machining could benefit from a spindle. If cutting metal you might need a flood/mister and yet again another level of complexity is added.
Lots of people on the forum have VFD spindles and can help program them but again another level of complexity.
The real question is what will a spindle do for you that the Makita/C3d/Dewalt routers cannot do. The routers are all around 1.25HP and for the money what will you gain with a spindle.
So if you think a spindle can do something that your existing router can then upgrade. The cost benefit analysis needs to be done to justify spending money on something you already have. Also consider the level of complexity that is introduced with the upgrade to a spindle. You will have to master each of these level of complexity and only you can answer if you can do that.
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A couple of clicks would reveal that Steve has a Shapeoko 5, so he shouldn’t have to worry about the mechanical bits.
Myself, If I was to go with a VFD spindle, I would go with a water cooled spindle.
It may take a little more maintenance than an air cooled, but from what I’ve read, they can last longer, and hold tolerances better.
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And I would prefer to buy one that I’m not locked out of the VFD settings.
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I’m running a MYSWEETY 1.5KW 65mm 120V water cooled spindle on my 3XXL with HDZ. It was the second best upgrade to the machine after the HDZ. The router mount it comes with is not useful, barely finished semi rough casting. I use the 65mm heavy duty mount from Carbide. Throw the aquarium pump away it will break before you get it wet. I went with a CW-3000 chiller unit. I have programmed the HY VFD to control the chiller and my dust collection using IOT power strips. It has been running well for 2 years and I would replace it in a second before going back to a LOUD router. My Fein Turbo 1 is the loudest component before cutter engagement. In all honesty on my platform an 800W spindle would have been adequate. I got it just before Carbide3D announced they would be producing one.
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I’ve worked with both types and frankly for many things an air spindle is just as good… but basically you cap out on a lower HP/wattage so if you’re someone who’s going to cut lots of metal things or care about squeeking out the last bit of speed… the higher power you can get the water cooled spindles at will benefit you. If you’re doing mostly wood etc… not so much.
The hassle with an air cooled spindle is obviously less; and less things to go wrong; no chance of leaks or – more likely – green growth in your tubes and all the other things that come with water… but while it’s less hassle it’s not to say that watercooling is all THAT much more.
The big thing a spindle got me over the routers is increased accuracy (less slop) and a LOT less noise. I first went spindle for the accuracy but you don’t realize how much you will not miss the sound of a router at top speed for a few hours.
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Running something other than water would fix the algae growth. I’ve heard windshield washer fluid works, or there’s a lot of options from the PC water cooling side that should work. Something with some antifreeze might be a good idea if in a garage.
As a point of reference : I’ve been using watercooled spindles for the last four years or so, after installation I have never had a single issue with the cooling setup, nor did I have any maintenance to do. I use RV antifreeze cooling fluid, no algae is willing to live in there.
There is definitely an entry cost (a decent chiller on top if the spindle and VFD cost), and configuring a VFD can be somewhat complex (unless you get C3D’s and it comes preconfigured) but after that it’s smooth sailing and I for one could never go back to a trim router. Nor would my wife allow me to, now that the noise coming from the garage has dropped.
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I can barely hear my router over my ClearVue dust collector. All this talk makes me think I should be running a smaller/quieter solution for the dust/chips. I have been a little concerned about wear on my collector for really long jobs. Up until CNC time it was usually on in shorter spurts for tablesaw, planer, etc…
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I bought a Festool CT midi (but any shopvac that can take long hours of continuous use will do) and put it and its associated cyclone dust separator in the lower (closed) compartment beneath my Shapeoko, with just enough active ventilation that it does not get too hot under there, and it reduced the dust collection noise level quite significantly
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Thanks for all the great info. Very helpful.
Hey Julien, could you elaborate more on your enclosed vacuum and active ventilation?
Some details here
I don’t have a picture of the inside of the lower compartment but it’s just 4 walls mounted around the legs of the bench my SO is resting on
The air flow is as follows:
- Air intake (a simple hole) in the upper right corner of the top part of the enclosure
- air is then sucked into the dust collection hose, makes its way through the cyclone separator and into the shopvac, which pushed it “out” (=inside the lower compartment at that point)
- the air extractor fan that is activated automatically when the shopvac is turned on, pulls the air out of the back of the lower compartment.
Sorry for deviating from the original thread topic.
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